Counting the Numbers of Welfare:
An Interview with Carrie Carpenter

Aired August 17, 1999

David C. Barnett–Got another statistic for you: 16,000 in greater Cleveland, that's how many make use of the services of the Center for Families and Children. Among those services are day care, Head Start, substance abuse prevention, home care, and a variety of other resources. Carrie Carpenter is the Director of Government Affairs for the Center for Families and Children and she joins us on the phone to help us put some flesh and bones on the statistics of welfare. Good morning, Carrie Carpenter.

Carrie Carpenter–Good morning.

DCB–Do you find that to be the case? One of the things that was just said in this story is that sometimes, when people are counting numbers, they're trying to channel them in certain categories which don't account for the reality of what's really going on.

CC–Well, certainly, and I think there's a number of people throughout the county that are coming off the welfare rolls and throughout the state that are being overlooked. When you look at some different case studies, you can find a number of people who are facing a number of additional barriers, that are having trouble complying with different welfare requirements.

DCB–Can you give us examples of, I mean, you hear about people on welfare, do you have a sense of how long somebody typically is on welfare?

CC–I actually don't know the statistics for that. I think your average case is a single mother with two children, not being able to make ends meet, frequently not receiving child support. Child support is actually one of the additional barriers that is being identified right now. The Cuyahoga Child Enforcement Agency is looking at different ways to address program specifically at non-custodial fathers who are not paying their child support, possibly asking them to participate in a fatherhood program or a job training program that would help them gain economic self-sufficiency that they need as individuals in order to make child support payments to their families and to help that population move off welfare.

DCB–Are people tending to want to stay off welfare, or is it pretty much the consensus that they want to get off?

CC–I think it depends on the individual. There are a number of people that are making a concerted effort to meet the participation requirement, I believe that number is around 45% of the families that are currently enrolled are meeting their participation and work requirements. There are an additional 30% that are not meeting their participation requirements for a variety of reasons, and of that population, certainly, some are not willing to comply with the regulations. Others face additional barriers; looking at the-Cuyahoga Work and Training thinks that up to 2600 families that are on welfare out of the 8000 right now might be caring for a disabled family member, and those people are in full-time care situations, and they're not able to meet that work requirement. Other barriers that are possibly cited are mental health and substance abuse problems. Right now, the county actually contracts with the Center for Families and Children with a program we have that's called Cleveland Cares. So, if a self-sufficiency coach at the county level thinks that mental health or substance abuse might be a problem with an individual, they're referred to our program, and we assess them as to whether this might be a problem with them, and then refer them to a treatment program.

DCB–One of your services which I think you might have just alluded to was something called Family Dependent Care Resource and Referral. Is that referring to the fact that you're taking care of somebody at home?

CC–Well, it can be. We have a number of different programs here at the center. Family Dependent Care is certainly one that the county needs to be looking at. There are a number of at-home programs where family members are caring for a disabled adult in their family or a disabled child, and they really need to legislatively be looked at and address whether or not that that is a population that the state and federal government really wants to make comply with the work requirement, or if they want to make an exception for that population legislatively.

DCB–We're two years into welfare reform. Can you give me your assessment, so far, to what extent has your organization had to adapt itself to what's happened and provided different services?

CC–Well, in a number of different ways, actually. When you're looking at child care, specifically, in Cuyahoga County, there are not enough child care slots in the county. We have waiting lists in most of our programs. The county actually just contracted with Starting Point to help expand the number of in-home child care providers, but we've had to adjust our hours to meet the needs of these families as they're moving into working situations. Another program, we've actually started a number of new programs that specifically address this population. One is our Fathers and Families Together program, which teaches non-custodial fathers parenting skills, give them job training and job placement, and tries to encourage them to be economically self-sufficient, which I alluded to earlier. Another program that is actually being developed right now by the county with the Center for Families and Children is a program called Safety Net. In this program, it's a really interesting program, people who have been sanctioned, out of the 8000 people that are on welfare right now, they're in a sanction situation for not complying with some component of their participation requirements. They are actually directly contacted by one of our employees, either by phone or through an at-home visit, to make sure that these people have access to the basic needs and services that will help them move toward self-sufficiency. They're also encouraged to comply with their work requirements so the sanction can be removed. They're assessed to determine if the kids are doing OK, and they're referred to other community services, so of the population, the 8000 people that are remaining on the welfare rolls, there are some programs that are being implemented by my agency, by the county, and by others to really look at these hard-to-serve cases and what can be done to help these families.

DCB–Are you concerned about the sanctions?

CC–Oh, certainly. We've got a single mom and two kids, and for some reason she's not complying, you know, you really have to look at why isn't she complying? Is it simply because she doesn't want to, or is it because she's facing some other situation? Did she not have a child care slot available, was there no child care available for the midnight shift that she works on? Did her car break down and she didn't have the extra $100 to fix it for her to get to work, because there's a lack of transportation to jobs out in suburbs like Solon where there is a lot of job development going on.

DCB–And those are all the gray areas that don't show up in the numbers.

CC–Yes, definitely, and that's what the Safety Net program is really looking to address, really looking to track and identify what is it these families need to help them become self-sufficient.

DCB–Carrie Carpenter is Director of Government Affairs for the Center for Families and Children. Thanks for joining us this morning.

CC–Thank you.